Moving to 16mm

[ComingApart]

I'm considering making the move from Super8 to 16mm, what would be a good camera for an absolute no-budget film maker?

[Jimsimm]

standard or super 16. You could pick up a cheap bolex standard 16 camera for about ?300 - ?500. For this price the camera is likely to be clockwork and non-sync...basically you get what you pay for and if you don't have a lot of cash...your not gonna get a great camera. Have you ever thought about hiring a super 16 camera. We hired one for a week...an aaton 7 kit (crystal sync) with a set of prime lenses, a zoom lense, 3 mags, matte box, batterys...the works and for only ?300 for the week! The film is expencive. Super 16 from kodak costs about ?90 per 400 ft excluding vat...! ouch I hear you say.
You could probably talk them around to giving them a discount...we tried but without success...so now we are loyal to another mayor film brand who would!
We hired the aaton camera from vivid in birmingham - www.vivid.org.uk
James
(p.s - don't be tempted to buy a cheap russian 16mm camera called a Krasnogorsk 3 (I think thats the name...i've heard they are bad news!!!)

[Jimsimm]

but if you don't live in the Uk...that information will be no use to you at all.

[goldfingerfilms]

If you dont spend a lot on a 16MM camera, the quality will not be there. It's either you buy a good 16 camera or you stay with Super 8. I suggest you go onto Uk's ebay and look around for cameras on there.
The Arriflex 'S' is by far one of the best 16MM cameras ever made. the Arriflex 'M' was used for Rodriguez's El Mariachi. These run for about 3 thousand, american dollars. Arriflex makes the best 16MM cameras, there's no doubt about that.

But whatever you do don't buy any shitty russian hand held cameras. Don't get Beilleux cameras either (Is that the spelling?)

Going to 16MM is a smart decision, but just remember you get what you pay for.

[nextspielberg]

If you dont spend a lot on a 16MM camera, the quality will not be there. It's either you buy a good 16 camera or you stay with Super 8. I suggest you go onto Uk's ebay and look around for cameras on there.
The Arriflex 'S' is by far one of the best 16MM cameras ever made. the Arriflex 'M' was used for Rodriguez's El Mariachi. These run for about 3 thousand, american dollars. Arriflex makes the best 16MM cameras, there's no doubt about that.

But whatever you do don't buy any shitty russian hand held cameras. Don't get Beilleux cameras either (Is that the spelling?)

Going to 16MM is a smart decision, but just remember you get what you pay for.

[N. Foster Tyler]

?

[N. Foster Tyler]

Shit, I doubt I'll be making that jump for a long time...as long as I'm making films on my own without backing, Super-8 is good enough for me. A lot of people can't tell the difference anyways; I shot my short film on Tri-X b&w Super-8 stock and a lot of folks thought it was 16.

[ComingApart]

I've been wrestling with this decision for a while, I don't mean to start any arguments, but I'm gonna post the Pro's/Cons of each format, as I see it, maybe the discussion will help me make my decision

16mm Pros-
Good Quality
Blows up better (35mm)
Quality video transfers and blow ups are cheaper
Credibility (people take 16mm projects more seriously than Super 8)


16mm Cons-
Equipment Expense (huge factor)
Film Stock expense
Loss of portability (compared to Super 8)
Alot more noticeable than Super 8 (this could be a pro or a con)

Super 8 Pros
Inexpensive equipment
Easier to work with "in the field" (cartridges as opposed to magazines)


Super 8 Cons-
Quality (compared ot larger formats)
Lack of available film stocks
Long turnaround on lab work
No sound film
Crystal motor for sync sound costs at least twice what the camera is worth
Lack of lenses/filter/attachments for cameras
No chance of getting a theater screening
Lack of credibility


Feel free to append the list as you see fit, I'd like to think I'm not the only person out there trying to make this decision.

[yak]

whats wrong with a beaulieu, ive just bought one, and it seems quite nice, did a lot on beaulieu s8 (5008s) and its great.
my 16 mm modell is the R16.tell me about experiences.

[Jimsimm]

If it's a blow up to 35mm that you are interested in...then I would not advise you to use standard 16mm. Super 16 matches the frame size of 35mm, standard does not, it's frame size roughly matches tv (approx ratio -3:4). If your going to master on video shoot on standard 16. If its for a blow up then I would highly recommend you shoot on super 16.

IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A FINAL FILM PRINT - Super 16 does not have the space for a soundtrack so if you shoot on super 16 and want to make a final print with sound you will have to blow up to 35mm.
SOLUTION - You can get a soundtrack on standard 16 and most feastivals will show standard 16!